If there is a God,
The arguing and hostility,
The why’s and what for’s,
The angry accusations
And demands for the truth
Must be meaningless in His eyes
Beside the screams of the innocent;
Screams that were heard by no one
Except the murderers and Him.
Author notes
Just thinking about 9/11 as the anniversary approaches, and sad about the fact that the tragedy, the war, Bush's actions, etc., have polarized Americans rather than uniting them, as tragedies should.
A lot of people think we should forget about 9/11, or at least not show the events of that day as much. However, as I said to a friend who responded to this poem, I can understand relatives and friends of people who died on 9/11 wanting to forget for their own peace of mind, but since the war on terrorism is still going on and will be for the unforeseeable future, I think it's important not to get complacent about the continuing threat. After all, al-quaeda (purposely not capitalized) is trying to get a nuclear warhead that would dwarf the 9/11 attacks. The enemy is not just overseas, they're walking among us. It's a time for vigilance, not forgetting.
Written September 9th, 2005
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Thanks, Mal. I agree. Forgetting would be a big mistake, perhaps our biggest ever. A friend of mine is a police office here in L.A. and he was doing chemical weapon attack training last week. He said if it happens, 9/11 will be nothing in comparison in terms of the death toll. The terrorists are also trying to get a nuclear warhead, and there are plenty out there. Hundreds have been unaccounted for since the Cold War ended - sold on the black market after the "arms race" ended. Where are they now? Nobody knows. It's a time for vigilance, not apathy and amnesia.
Thanks,
Mark -
sad-but-true
I just checked out your poem Behind These Clouded Eyes and enjoyed it very much. Great work. Thanks for your thoughts on this.
Mark
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heismysong,
You've shared a lot of your feelings about God and the Bible with me through this piece and the "big questions". You may have noticed that I haven't engaged you in any arguments because I decided that under the "big questions" anyway, I wouldn't argue. As I stated at the beginning of each questions, I was going to "respect and appreciate" all responses. But since you chose this unrelated poem to again insinuate that I am lost for not knowing God the way you do, etc., I figured maybe I should share some of my thoughts with you.
Your statement -
"Would God forgive a terrorist if he forsook what he'd done and confessed Christ? The Bible says yes. Would God allow someone that died tragically in one of those towers to go to Hell for not accepting His Son? Again, biblically, the answer is yes."
- is exactly the kind of remark that has prevented me from becoming a Christian and made me turn away from the Bible. Why would I follow a book, or a God, that don't reflect my values? I can only hope that the Bible is wrong and God is more intelligent than that. To give paradise to a murdering psychopath and to give eternal damnation to a good person just because he/she didn't say "I accept Jesus Christ as my savior" is psychotic in itself.
And again, please don't worry about me not "knowing God the way you do." I'm not lost. In fact, I'm very happy. And none of us, including you, will really know what awaits us after life until the moment we die. Every opinion about God and religion is just that - an opinion based on faith and hope. There is no way to know for sure. The Bible was maintained by oral tradition for centuries (telephone game) and has been tampered with/edited/elaborated on many times over the centuries. Who knows what Jesus really said? Then there's the fact that it was written by men who would probably mess themselves if they had to deal with some of the things modern men deal with on a daily basis. Guns, terrorism, gangs, the fear of nuclear and chemical weapon attacks, etc. i.e., The Bible is a book written by simple, superstitious men in an infinitely simpler time. I know there are some universal, timeless truths in it, but much about it no longer applies to the world we live in, much the same way the U.S. Constitution has become outdated and has required amendments over the years.
As far as God "taking his eye off the nation" during 9/11, that's unacceptable, too. A store manager would be fired for such negligence. Ergo, God is not managing his store (earth) well enough. If it was some kind of punishment, then the tsunami in Indonesia and the hurricane in Louisiana must have been, too, and I'm sure a lot of Christians were swallowed up in those waters along with the sinners.
I can make no sense whatsoever of God's management or mismanagement of this world, so I have chosen to allow Him/Her/It to be a mystery. My impulse most of the time is to just declare myself an atheist and forget the questions, but I'm hedging my bets. And if I get up there and he asks me why I wasn't more faithful, I'll tell him he didn't give me enough proof. Again, and as always, my questions are, "How do we separate his hand from an imagination fed by despair?"
In the end, I think I'm probably an absurdist. If there is a God, he's just letting the chips fall where they may and not getting involved. There's too much unrewarded virtue and unpunished evil, too many catastrophes, plagues, murders and rapes of innocents, mass starvation, genocides, etc., to believe otherwise. Therefore, it's a meaningless universe and our own happiness, meaning and very survival is our own responsibility. As far as fixing what's wrong with the world, I believe if people don't do it, it won't get done. Time spent praying is time spent not DOING something.
Those are my true feelings about religion. I still pray now and then just in case, but basically I think we're all alone and kidding ourselves like the basketball player or boxer who prays for a win, as if God takes time out from all the major problems in the world to make sure some helmet-carrying, self-centered bonehead wins another trophy.
I guess what I'm really saying is it makes all the misery in the world easier to deal with if I just accept the idea that we're alone and we all need to help each other, because God is almost always conspicuously absent. Is it because there is no God, or that God cares but watches helplessly, or that God actively participates in it all? The Bible shows God engaging in or aiding others in mass murder many times. (The 40-day flood was the biggest act of genocide ever. Even if we are God's little ants and he can give life and take it away at will, it's still murder.) So I guess he wouldn't mind a few thousand or million of us getting slaughtered today, either, assuming the Bible is true.
Anyway, thanks again for your thoughts.
Take care,
Mark -
Never forget to remember. 9/11 shook the world and we must under no circumtances allow it's memory to slip away. Thank you for reminding me. Take care...Mal
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Mark, this is a poem of little words but it has so much emotion and love put into it that I have shed a tear. I will NEVER forget what the terrorism of 9/11 has done to me. I hope you get a chance to look at my poem called "behind these clouded eyes" because this is a poem I wrote with the, then, upcoming anniversary of 9/11. ~Val~ )
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Hello, Mr. Rickerby (-or Mark, or whatever you prefer...)
I just wanted to read something else you've written besides your questions, although I do enjoy answering them!
This one, because of the title of course, caught my eye. It made me kind-of wish you knew God like I do...
Reading this also made me think of something... I was attending a private Christian college at the time the Twin Towers were hit. They annouced in Chapel what happened.
Not long after that, the Campus Church pastor preached a sermon on the verses from Acts 17:28-30. Verse thirty reads like this: "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:"
He talked about God "winking" His eye, not in a way to make someone blush or attract attention, but rather to ignore the wickedness going on around- something like a flinch, I suppose.
He said something to the effect that maybe God took His eye off of this nation, even if it was just for a moment, for a reason... maybe to get their attention.
Sometimes when children blatantly do things that parents have told them repeatedly NOT to do, they overlook something for the purpose of letting their consequences teach them, which can sometimes be pretty severe. Well, if a lighter punishment doesn't work, severity may just be in order... so says a story I read in the Children's Book of Virtues.
People just don't understand God, or the way He loves. Yes, 9-11 was a major tragedy... but don't think for one second that God didn't care about those people- He did. He heard them... some He took home. (And, if you have any concept of Heaven, you know that it is BY FAR a better place to be! BAR NONE!) Others... He wanted to take home, but they never let Him.
Would God forgive a terrorist if he forsook what he'd done and confessed Christ? The Bible says yes. Would God allow someone that died tragically in one of those towers to go to Hell for not accepting His Son? Again, biblically, the answer is yes.
Men who do not know God cannot understand this. But God promises that those who are seeking to know the truth, it will be shown unto them.
I pray that all these questions you ask have a reason. I really do enjoy answering them. I know I'm not a great Bible guru or anything like that. Heck- I just teach second grade! But God has shown me a lot these last few years, and I just have to share it with others!
I hope I can catch you on here sometime. I know my comments are long, and I'd rather talk in "person" once if possible.
I put you on my favorite's list, too. I'm going to try to read more of your stuff. I can't promise wonderful critiques, but I'll do my best!
Edited on Sep 17, 10:25 p.m. because 'word goof'. -
Hi Mark,
This is one of those put it in our face pieces that we need to see and to read. It will never be erased from the minds of any American whether we lost a loved one or not, we all lost neighbors. I can't imagine the things God must have heard.
No attempt to put this away, can change what has happened. This poem is a reminder of the rest of the reality we live still today. There still are those among us just waiting to try something again.
In your notes the thing that spoke the loudest was the explanation as to why the enemy's name wasn't capitalized. Whoa!
I hope that God wants us to wake up. I listen to songs that ask,
do you remember that day and ones that say we'll put a boot up your ass.....and just shake my head at the experts who say we need to put it away. How can we?
The words you've penned in this poem are well chosen. I like that you not only tell what his eyes experienced, which tied the title in. You also mention what He heard. Very effective!
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Aw, thanks for the hug. I appreciate it. You're right - I was devastated by 9/11. I'm still in denial that it even happened sometimes when I watch it. A lot of my writings on this subject are laced with anger and vengeance toward terrorists in general, and that has caused a lot of heated debate under my works. I still feel that way. I'm a big believer in punishing evil. I've even gotten into a debate about what "evil" is with someone, as if it's difficult to spot. lol But these are confusing times and my support for the decisions President Bush has made have fluctuated greatly. And his ties with the Bin Laden family make me very uneasy, to say the least. Hopefully, we'll all know someday exactly what is going on. Then again, maybe we won't. It's so hard to know what the truth is.
I was having a friendly argument with a friend the other night and he kept asking how I knew the sources I was using to illustrate my points weren't propaganda. I asked him the same question. He had to admit he didn't know. Every news channel, every author, every journalist, etc., all have their own political leanings, so how do we find a truly unbiased source of information? Who the hell knows what to believe? All I know is terrorism immediately overrides other evils and makes the opinions, demands and complaints of the terrorists meaningless. In fact, I think the civilized world is obligated to destroy terrorists. Listening to them after they slaughter innocents is a desecration and an insult to the memory of the slaughtered.
Four years ago, about seven hours from now, a friend called me and said, "Turn on your TV, Mark. You're not gonna believe this." They say the terrorists have nukes and are planning to use them. Now I fear that 9/11 will someday seem like a small skirmish in comparison.
It is true that nothing will change unless the hearts of men change, but the Muslim terrorists don't think in terms of good and bad, they think in terms of Muslim and non-Muslim, so changing their hearts is impossible. Four years later, I still believe they're the Nazi's of our age.
Thanks again for the hugs. Always nice to hear from you. Sorry for the rant. lol
Mark
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hey Mark. it is actually september the eleventh in australia. it is a little creepy to think it is the attack's birthday for you guys tomorrow. i dont know what to say really, this is a great write, and it is so extremely devastating that you felt you had to write it. i truly wish i could applaud this, but i ran out of thingy's for today.
but, i will give you a hug
and one for the road
bye bye Mark -
Well, Lencio, like I always say, we seem to be cut from the same cloth, my friend.
I hope you're doing well. Always nice to hear from you.
Mark
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Mary Jon,
Fortunately, there aren't a lot of 911 widows on this site or I would hesitate to post such poems out of respect for them, but like it or not, the images of 911 will be with this country forever. Posting poems like this is my way of trying to change hearts, specifically (in regard to this poem) to see beyond the bickering to the human tragedy and the spirituality on both sides of a terrorist attack, or lack thereof. One thing I do know is apathy and ignorance doesn't change hearts, it only guarantees that what we're trying to ignore will happen again.
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Hi Mark,
I am so glad to read this, and satisfied to see that you have finished what I had started writing. I had started with two lines beginning...If there is a God, and for some reason never finished it, it never will I suppose, moreover now you have already finished it for which I am happy. Just to let you know, that once again I was sharing your thought. And glad you are back with your picture
Hope all is well with you, speak soon,
Lencio -
Aristotle said, it is not life that wears us out but the daily living of life. I don't know about you. but I am so busy with today, and it's many problems, I can barely remember yesterday. I tell my grandaughters about being able to walk the streets alone at night .. they look at me like I have old timers disease. Someone above said it correctly I think; The heart of man needs to be reached before these problems will be solved. Greed, all that comes in to play .. can we get rid of that by remembering, by dragging out old photos and making widows weep one more time???
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I agree completely. My friend's cousin died in one of those twin towers ( I believe it was the first tower that the first plane crashed into ) and her family is always telling her to forget, but she was close to her cousin and its hard to forget something such a tragic as 9/11 when there are reminders everywhere, like the Iraq war... its just sad
... Keep Writing, as always, you have written a masterpiece, I don't think you could ever write a bad piece 
... mainly because most of your poetry consists of society (not sure if I spelled that right) and your morals and beliefs. You stand true by them and I admire you tremendously for that. Love you!!!!! Sara 
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My dear Mark,
No we don't want to forget. To forget means that you open the doors for it to happen again. Like the Holocaust,you must make people remember so they won't forget. Unfortunately, as Keith has said, we have failed to learn our lessons from past history. Even after the first bombing on the WTC, we American's were far too arrogant to believe it could ever happen again. We've gotten our wake up call!
God? No my friend, this is not God's action. God gave us the minds with which to think and have choices. When one human points a weapon at another, he has made a conscience decision to do so. I imagine God watches down on us with such a profoud sadness that causes oceans of tears. So much so it creates tidal waves. His head aspin and his heart aghast that His soul cries out "What have I done". Creating so much pain it sears His core like a hurricane. I can accept a natural disaster. It is the shifting of time and space. I cannot, willnot accept man's assault on man.God has nothing to do with it! God does hear, you just have to speak up so He can hear you. He doesn't read minds you know!
I do like the fact that you question everything about you. I also love the fact that inspite of it all, you have a wonderful caring and giving soul.A most gentle soul.
~Michelle~
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I am not saying for a moment that terrorism is not a threat. However, it is also a handy way for world governments to avoid dealing with other issues. While mankind argues interracially and interdemoninationally, the planet is altering. Earthquakes, Hurricanes, Rising Ocean levels are all being caused by mankind's reckless destruction of the environment. If there is a God, then He or She gave mankind choice. God does not cause natural disasters any more then he causes international hatreds and strife. Mankind does it for himself. Look to the future, and let the past teach us worthwhile lessons. So far, the message does not seem to be getting through.
Edited on Sep 10, 5:07 because ''. -
I have read that they have more than one warhead and have a plan to set them off. For this to be wrong would give me great pleasure. Serious times like we've never seen.
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I'm proud of you, Mark...always have been, always will be... Wanda
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Mark, this still makes me feel the same way I did when I watched to towers fall that day--mortified and aghast, terribly sad and angry. None of us should forget 9-11, nor that we should stand for life and defend it. Your poem is very effective in its message. Terrorism will not go away on its own.
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Hear hear! Well stated! Your poem and your author's comments! I love the poem because it is brief. It is more powerful that way. Serious statements have far more impact if they deliver the message and then go silent, letting the reader think. You did an excellent job. I don't think most of us will ever forget 9/11. It changed the world as we know it. I was telling my husband the other day, that I am grateful that I born and raised during a time when the world was not so scary. When you could actually go to an airport and see someone off, or greet them at the gate. When you didn't have to go through metal detectors....the list goes on and on. My future grandchildren (if any) will never know a world like that. They will only know what I tell them of how things USED to be. Great poem!
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i like the way you get to the meat of your view without disallowing other opinions.i can't say that i see this as another thing to blame on God.I know he is present.i can't say that i would put the blame solely on satan either.it's more to me like the choices people make.everyone wants their choice to be the ultimate one and when man starts to believe they have more power than God,then there were bad choices made.you are right about not forgetting.as long as we remember we stay aware.being aware could mean the difference between life and death.
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I can understand relatives and friends of people who died on 9/11 wanting to forget it but since the war on terrorism is still going on and will be for the unforeseeable future, I think it's important not to get complacent about the continuing threat. After all, al-quaeda is trying to get a nuclear warhead that would dwarf the 9/11 attacks. The enemy is not just overseas, they're walking among us. It's a time for vigilance, not forgetting.
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I don't know what to say to this. It keeps coming up ... I know wives of firefghters that say they wish people would let it rest because it freshens in all over in their mind. As to God .. hmmm another one.
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uhmm very sensitive issue....but I liked the way you have said in few lines...short and touching..espcially the climax ...so very true!
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